Oh Boy. Here Comes the Riots.

[Claude Whitacre]

Multiple times in the head or chest. Seems like once in the shoulder will not suffice.

 

These folks are trained in marksmanship, are they not? They take pride in their skills as trained law enforcement officers, do they not?

 

Yes. Multiple times in the head and chest. Really, they are shooting at the body mass. They are aiming and shooting in a fraction of a second. They have to assume that you are trying to kill them. If you have a gun or knife, that's 100% what they act on.

 

 

 

The police do NOT have the right to be judge, jury and executioner,

 

No. And in nearly all cases, they are not deciding that someone needs to die. They are reacting to a threat. And the way to react to that threat is to shoot them, multiple times, until they are no longer a threat. 

 

 

 

because 'they were in fear for their life' which has become the de facto mantra of all police shootings.

 

 

Whether they are actually in fear of their life is immaterial. If an armed person is a perceived threat, and they don't immediately drop the weapon, the police officer's job is to stop the threat, to the officer and others.

 

 

 

 

If you are that afraid of someone running away from you and you feel the need to shoot them in the back, multiple times, resign and get a job that matches-up with your courage quotient.

 

In every case I see on TV or video, my first question is "Is this justified in any way? and my second is "What could have happened before the video, that we aren't aware of?"  It isn't a matter of being afraid, or bring brave. And the guy that got shot multiple times in the back, while he was running away, didn't deserve to get shot. And the officer that shot him, in my opinion, is guilty of murder.

 

 

 

Bowling alley manager sound good, but watch out for that tinea pedis. Scary stuff!

I don't know what that last one meant.

[Ashley]

[sbucciarel]

Whether they are actually in fear of their life is immaterial. If an armed person is a perceived threat, and they don't immediately drop the weapon, the police officer's job is to stop the threat, to the officer and others.

 

 

In Minnesota, there was a family in that car. The driver was a beloved, law abiding citizen who happened to also be licensed to carry a gun. He informed the cop of that fact. He did not have the gun in his hand. He was reaching for his ID. There was a child in that car and the child's mother in that car. He had a broken tail light and was shot down by a cop.

 

The guy in Baton Rouge, it was plain to see on the video was on the ground pinned down by these morons they call cops. The cop unloaded that weapon into him and only afterwards, did he pull a gun out of his pocket. The gun wasn't in his hand. He was shot in the front and shot in the back. Gunned down like an animal.

 

... and people are surprised at all the public backlash?

[JohnHemmer]

#ignoring the facts ---> believe what you want. 

 

 

Yes Donna. It is very clear that is what you do. Ignore facts and just believe what you want.

[mki]

Back to the riots...

 

 

http://www.startribune.com/about-100-arrested-in-st-paul-protests/386197981/

 

"The injuries were not considered serious"

[kay king]

Claude - you said it better than I could.

 

I fully agree people have the right to protest - but I also know the 'leaders' often try to get arrested.  However, they usually don't break the law or get violent...though

they may influence others in that direction.

 

I totally support those  who have a grievance or perceive a wrong and use their constitutional right to protest yet I have no tolerance for the

professional protesters who go from one cause to another leading the same "hay hay ho ho" chants and providing signs and "camera moments".  Too often, those 'career protesters' are

using the situation to promote their own anti-gun or anti-cop or racist agendas.  That's why a victim is not shown as real person he was.  He is portrayed as the loving father and

good guy who never did anything wrong....rather than the deadbeat dad who did time in prison for child molestation.

 

Whether the guy was a creep or not has nothing to do with the shooting.  It was either justified or not - and an honest prosecutor and court can decide that.  That's THEIR job.

[JohnHemmer]

Donna,

 

Most of the protests are peaceful. You can cherry pick shit all day long to fit your narrative. 

 

And blocking public paths is a pretty common tactic used by peaceful protests going back decades. There have been sit-ins in public buildings and stairs. There have been people blocking a street. That is pretty normal, and nothing out of the ordinary.

[JohnHemmer]

And just to be clear, there is a long history in the USA of violent protests too, up to and including civil war, led by white people.

 

Hell, one of the most famous protests in American history involved the destruction of private property, The Boston Tea Party.

 

Please don't act like it is just black people that have gotten violent at protests. You sound like an ignorant racist when you do that.

[Claude Whitacre]

In Minnesota, there was a family in that car. The driver was a beloved, law abiding citizen who happened to also be licensed to carry a gun.

 

Suzanne; Yes, these are all facts.

 

 

He informed the cop of that fact. He did not have the gun in his hand. He was reaching for his ID.

 

We don't know that. We can assume that, but we don't know that.

 

 

 

There was a child in that car and the child's mother in that car. He had a broken tail light and was shot down by a cop.

 

 

Yes. He had a child in the car. Yes. the child's mother was in the car. No, he was not shot because he had a broken tail light.

 

 

 

The guy in Baton Rouge, it was plain to see on the video was on the ground pinned down by these morons they call cops.

 

 

Yes, that's what the video shows. 

 

 

 

The cop unloaded that weapon into him and only afterwards, did he pull a gun out of his pocket. The gun wasn't in his hand.

 

Was that in the video? Did we see that? If you say you did, I'll believe you. I just didn't see that in the video I watched.

 

 

 

 

He was shot in the front and shot in the back.

 

Yes.

 

Gunned down like an animal.

 

 

Maybe.

 

... and people are surprised at all the public backlash?

Suzanne; Don't you see that public opinions are always one way or the other? There is almost never an objective viewing of video.... An objective look at evidence. 

 

"There was a child in that car and the child's mother in that car."

 

I get why that's important to you. But it doesn't register in the split second decision a cop makes. Did the policeman shoot too soon? Maybe. But we don't know what happened before the camera started.

 

 

"He had a broken tail light and was shot down by a cop."

 

I get it. I do. But that's not a reasonable statement.  He did have a broken tail light, and that's why he was stopped. But that's not why he was shot. 

 

 

 

That's why a victim is not shown as real person he was.  He is portrayed as the loving father and

good guy who never did anything wrong....rather than the deadbeat dad who did time in prison for child molestation.

 

 

None of that was known when he was stopped. And even if it was, it shouldn't influence the cop's actions.  To me, "justified" means, did the officer follow his training...follow the law. Maybe he did, and maybe he didn't. Nothing I saw on video gave evidence either way.

 

 

 

Whether the guy was a creep or not has nothing to do with the shooting.  It was either justified or not - and an honest prosecutor and court can decide that.  That's THEIR job.

 

 

That's it. And some people will think that's cold. I get the emotional reactions...the anger.....the positioning....but thinking it's being objective is a mistake.  

[kay king]

 

These folks are trained in marksmanship, are they not?

 

 

No, Frank, - not like on  TV.  They are trained to shoot for the trunk of the body.  

 

Truth is - many officers serve until retirement and never once shoot their gun while on duty. 

 

They are taught to shoot for the trunk of the body.  There is no "shoot to wound" as a wounded criminal can still shoot you or someone else. My son is an excellent marksman -

and carries on the job - but he said if he ever has to point his weapon at someone or shoot them...the target is the largest part of the body.Best chance of hitting them - and best way to disable them.

 

That sounds cold and calculating - but cops are working a job and their training is designed to keep them - and bystanders - as safe as possible.   The training doesn't focus as much on protecting the safety of the person

with a gun who won't hold still or keep his hands up or who tries to fight or flee police.  Of course there are weak cops, bad cops, scared cops who react too fast....but they are not the majority. 

 

 

In my opinion - everything in this discussion should avoid use of terms like "ignorant" and "racist" - tossing those around has never solved anything at any time.  It's a discussion killer.

 

If a troll wants to hold forth and spew - just talk over the troll and ignore him.

[JohnHemmer]

@JohnTheFlamer

 

Blah, blah, and more blah from you.....you sound like the ignorant racist here. Bury your head in the sand and blame everyone but the people and groups that should be blamed for the looting, violence and disruption.

 

Call some more names, ignore some more facts, ignore some more laws, ignore some more violence, ignore the black on black crime rates, and turn off all media except those you are tunnel vision tuned to.

 

Keep posting flame...apparently it's the only thing you can do.

 

It's people like you that throw the term racist out when you see a disturbing video or are enlightened to facts that you don't like that are dividing this country even further.

 

Unfortunately for America, Intelligent discussion is not your strong suit.

 

So sad.

 

 

Donna,

 

You are the one that keeps ignoring facts. You cherry pick bullshit and try to say that is what is happening across the nation instead of admitting that those things are the exceptions, not the norms.

 

Still don't understand why you even come to this forum or why you are allowed here after all the bullshit and lies you made up about this place. I mean, I understand you were probably devastated after getting banned again from WF and not getting that mod promotion you were bucking so hard for and needed somewhere to go. I guess that 25-page PDF didn't help. Or was it 26 pages? I forget now.

 

There are plenty of other places to go. Why go to the one place where nobody likes or respects you?

[The AMOL]

Of course there are weak cops, bad cops, scared cops who react too fast....but they are not the majority. 

And, beyond those there are racist cops, psychopathic cops, delusional cops, drug-addled cops and any other label that you can apply to any other group of human beings. How are they different from society as a whole? Oh, right - there's that little thing called having the power to be able to instantly end someone's life with a very high likelihood of getting off scot-free.

 

No, they are no where near the majority, but even one is one too many and they need to be eliminated, quickly and permanently. This problem will never end until they are eradicated and I believe that if they were, most of the issues that we are dealing with today in this regard would somehow magically disappear.

 

For every action there is an equal an opposite reaction. Newton figured it out. Why can't the police?

 

Cheers. - Frank

[JohnHemmer]

But it does not fit the false narrative that cops are out to intentionally gun people down.

 

1 cop in 755 fired at a suspect intentionally in NYC (2012).

1 cop in 850 did so in 2013 (NYC).

 

Dipshit,

 

It is not a false narrative. It is happening. It is being recorded. 

 

Whether or not unarmed civilians are being gunned down by police officers is not in dispute by any rational human being.

 

Holy shit, and you say other people are ignoring facts. 

[JohnHemmer]

You ignore all the facts except for cop shootings that have not yet been adjudicated.

 

Nice name calling - you win the forum prize for calling the most names while presenting the least amount of factual information.

 

You back your flame up with name calling.

 

Great member you are.

 

 

 

Really? You are worried about name calling? What a worthless pile of Dung you are. You started the attacks, and now you don't like it. Poor baby. 

 

The guy who cried like a little bitch on another forum about someone creating multiple accounts there, but then does the same thing here.

 

The guy who reports every rule violation, but then breaks them himself. 

[TheDarkestKnight]

 

Nice name calling - you win the forum prize for calling the most names while presenting the least amount of factual information.

 

In John's defense, you are a massive asshole Don. 

[mki]

Riots are not peaceful protests.

 

 

Lets talk about this in terms of

 

cause->effect

problem->solution

 

if the effect is protests/riots/violence

 

I think the cause of that effect is, people losing their lives to police officers, and people getting very upset about it, to the point which they've organized. I don't think the fact that organized protests are occurring is disputable (some which I think have crossed the threshold between a protest to something more like a riot.)

 

So is the problem the protests/riots/violence?

 

Or is the problem, that people are losing their lives to police officers?

 

I personally don't know how you solve the protests/riots problem without dealing with the cause of those protests/riots.

 

You have made some comments and some posts which seem, to me, say "Look at what effect is."

 

Police officers have been killed as a "retaliation" as an unfortunate and despicable "effect."

 

Are you going to legitimately suggest that we, as American citizens, should be okay with some police officers (note: some) killing people, without being convicted of a crime, and we are just suppose to shut up and ignore it?

 

Or do you have any actual solution to the real problem? What is our government suppose to do? What is America suppose to do?

 

These events have led to many Americans, being extremely upset, to the point at which, I do think more of them will intentionally hurt or kill people over this.

 

AND, they haven't even seen how our judicial system will react, which as I already mentioned earlier in this thread, there most likely, will not be a conviction for any of the three officers.

 

For the royally pissed off/protesting/rioting people, it's definitely beyond "demanding answers", whether you agree or not, they see a pattern, they have spoken, and some of them are taking action.

 

The day those cases resolve, I know exactly what I will be doing. I'll be at my computer, watching it live, saying "Holy Shit. This is a Shit Storm..." It already is...

[The AMOL]

In John's defense, you are a massive asshole Don. 

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[Ashley]

And the video that reflects badly on the "peaceful protesters" on the riot thread is deleted.

 

Below we see people dancing on the dead cops in the face of the cops protecting them.

 

If I delete one of your videos, don't repost it. Pretty simple.

 

Frankly, I don't trust anything you post, but if the video is real, it is disgraceful and disgusting and does not belong here.

 

There is no way we are going to welcome that kind of content.

[Ashley]

@mki

 

Discuss with yourself and the lefties. My Fox news 1 minute live Dallas video of what happened at the 7-11 store down the street from where the cops were shot has been deleted.

 

Selective edits by the left for the left ain't my style.

 

Adios Amigos

 

 

Don,

 

It was not removed because of any political bias. It was removed because it is in poor taste.

[TheDarkestKnight]

 

Automated message from forum bot!

 

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SpartaBot2000

 

 

Point taken. I was trying to be kind though.

[JohnHemmer]

Adios Amigos

 

Please don't tease us. 

[ThomasBelknap]

Point taken. I was trying to be kind though.

 

Frank was more than likely saying you were too kind to begin with.  

[The AMOL]

Please don't tease us. 

Don't worry. He'll be back. An absolute total lack of impulse control and a desperate need for attention. Give it an hour.  :-)

 

Cheers. - Frank

[mki]

@mki

Discuss with yourself and the lefties. My Fox news 1 minute live Dallas video of what happened at the 7-11 store down the street from where the cops were shot has been deleted.

Selective edits by the left for the left ain't my style.

Adios Amigos

So you really were here just to troll and spam crap and you can't even admit you don't have any answers.

That's pathetic.

I'll admit, I don't personally know how America should deal with this problem.

But I'm not going to sit here and blame the wrong people.

The problem exists because we haven't done squat about it and it will just get worse and worse until something happens.

[ThomasBelknap]

I try to avoid politics these days but what the hell.  haha

 

I see quite a few issues here.

 

First and foremost, I don't think anyone condones the murder of anyone, including cops.  It was a travesty.

 

The BLM group and many politicians are inciting violence against cops.  Attacks on cops were happening before the Dallas massacre and will continue until the whole "kill the cops" rhetoric is stopped.   Videos of BLM protestors in other cities were captured saying something similar.  Look at social sites like twitter and facebook to see the same.   This will only lead to more violence.

 

The time of cops protecting each other at the detriment of the people they serve needs to stop.  Otherwise these type of attacks will continue.   Body cams should be mandatory and because of video we are seeing how cops can behave when no one is looking.  I have had my own run ins with cops and they have the power to basically do whatever they want with you when no one is looking.  It isn't cool being screwed with when you are not a danger to them.

 

The guy killed in Minnesota had been stopped over 50 times.  That is racial profiling and it needs to be stopped.  I don't care about statistics when it comes to the loss of our rights and freedom.  We are either free or we are not.  Being hassled because of statistics isn't freedom.   Sure, we may end up being a little less safe.   It's worth it.  Same as the people trying to take guns away from law abiding citizens because it would be "safer".   Maybe a little safer, but not enough, imo.